26 Feb 2004 08:16:24
s_knight8
Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

http://www.suntimes.com/output/rapoport/cst-spt-rap26.html

The Detroit Pistons got a lot of attention earlier this week when they
were fined $200,000 for not completing the proper forms before
allowing two newly acquired players, Rasheed Wallace and Mike James,
to suit up. That's a lot of money for a paperwork snafu, to be sure,
but it's only the tip of the iceberg of the thriving little side
business the NBA's Department of Reparations has going. What the
league lacks in consistency when it comes to assessing fines, it more
than makes for up in volume while also providing an interesting look
at what goes on during the course of an NBA season.



Here are just some of the fines that have been handed down this
season. See if you can find a method to the NBA's madness.

Tracy McGrady was fined $10,000 for kicking a ball into the stands,
but Tim Floyd got away with a mere $5,000 for the same infraction.
Kevin Garnett of the Timberwolves and Ruben Patterson of the Trail
Blazers, on the other hand, were fined $5,000 each for throwing a ball
into the stands.

Jason Kidd was fined $10,000 for verbally abusing a ref, but Jermaine
O'Neal was assessed only $5,000. Coaches Scott Skiles, Don Nelson and
Maurice Cheeks were each hit with $7,500 fines for taking it out on
the officials. Shaquille O'Neal was the big loser in this department
when he lost a day's pay, $275,000, for swearing while criticizing the
refs.

Then there is the matter of taunting the folks on the sideline.
Latrell Sprewell was fined $25,000 for the grief he gave the Knicks'
owners and bench, but it cost Allen Iverson only $10,000 for making
obscene gestures to the crowd in Milwaukee. Go figure.

The Jazz was fined $25,000 for a comedy routine mocking Karl Malone
and Kobe Bryant, but the Cavaliers got off with a $5,000 fine when
their mascot made fun of former teammate Ricky Davis. Perhaps that's a
commentary on the greater star value of the Lakers' players, who
knows?

Gary Payton had a rough week in which he was fined $15,000 for
fighting with the Warriors' Speedy Claxton and $25,000 for not taking
part in the skills challenge at the All-Star Game. He could have just
written a check to Baron Davis, who earned $25,000 for winning that
event.

Of all the fines handed down lately, though, I have to admit to a
personal favorite. It came when Suns assistant Tim Grgurich was
relieved of $7,500 for verbally abusing a member of the media. I never
thought I'd live to see the day.


26 Feb 2004 22:01:07
Mphsrick43
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

the nba is a model of inconsistancy. it has gotten to be a joke. no take that
back it surpased a joke years ago and has gotten to the point it is
embarrassing. if the nba does not step up soon to clean up some of these
problems by themselves they may force the hand of officials in government to
step in. i wonder what we would find if we were to remove all the layers of
bullshit coming out of the nba offices. there have been rumors that officials
are told to keep certain players in the games, there is talk that certain
officials retired because of tax problems while others say that it wasn't
taxes as much as gambling. maybe it is time for an independent council to wade
through all the rumors.


26 Feb 2004 14:23:58
Dean
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

> Here are just some of the fines that have been handed down this
> season. See if you can find a method to the NBA's madness.

They have a tendency to fine a person more if they have more money. No one
else would have gotten fined $500,000 for critizing officiating! Since it
goes to charity, is it tax deductible? =)

But otherwise, they use a combination of the dartboard, 8-ball, and wheel of
fortune method.




27 Feb 2004 01:13:36
Isaac
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

On 26 Feb 2004 08:16:24 -0800, s_knight8 <s_knight8@hotmail.com > wrote:
>
> Here are just some of the fines that have been handed down this
> season. See if you can find a method to the NBA's madness.
>
> Tracy McGrady was fined $10,000 for kicking a ball into the stands,
> but Tim Floyd got away with a mere $5,000 for the same infraction.
> Kevin Garnett of the Timberwolves and Ruben Patterson of the Trail
> Blazers, on the other hand, were fined $5,000 each for throwing a ball
> into the stands.

Tracy actually kicked two balls into the stands.

> Jason Kidd was fined $10,000 for verbally abusing a ref, but Jermaine
> O'Neal was assessed only $5,000. Coaches Scott Skiles, Don Nelson and
> Maurice Cheeks were each hit with $7,500 fines for taking it out on
> the officials. Shaquille O'Neal was the big loser in this department
> when he lost a day's pay, $275,000, for swearing while criticizing the
> refs.

I don't think a suspension should be compared with a fine. Otherwise
we'd have to make suspensions proportional to salary. Shaq could only
be suspended for the first 5 minutes of games to match other players
getting a full game suspension.

> Then there is the matter of taunting the folks on the sideline.
> Latrell Sprewell was fined $25,000 for the grief he gave the Knicks'
> owners and bench, but it cost Allen Iverson only $10,000 for making
> obscene gestures to the crowd in Milwaukee. Go figure.
>
> The Jazz was fined $25,000 for a comedy routine mocking Karl Malone
> and Kobe Bryant, but the Cavaliers got off with a $5,000 fine when
> their mascot made fun of former teammate Ricky Davis. Perhaps that's a
> commentary on the greater star value of the Lakers' players, who
> knows?

Or maybe a comment on the degree of tastelessness of the skit.

Isaac


26 Feb 2004 18:39:32
Terraholm
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets


"Isaac" <isaac@latveria.castledoom.org > wrote in message
news:slrnc3t6fd.7m.isaac@latveria.castledoom.org...

> > the officials. Shaquille O'Neal was the big loser in this department
> > when he lost a day's pay, $275,000, for swearing while criticizing the
> > refs.
>
> I don't think a suspension should be compared with a fine. Otherwise
> we'd have to make suspensions proportional to salary. Shaq could only
> be suspended for the first 5 minutes of games to match other players
> getting a full game suspension.


Actually a suspension is a better proportional punishment. 1/90 of their
pay. Hits a minimum player just as hard as Shaq. It also effects more than
their bank account so may better get their attention.


--
Laurel T
You can tell a gelding,
you can ask a mare,
but you must discuss it with a stallion.
-unknown horseman





27 Feb 2004 03:01:16
Granville Waiters' Ghost
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

In article <6bd12cd6.0402260816.13d61e2b@posting.google.com >,
s_knight8@hotmail.com (s_knight8) wrote:

> Tracy McGrady was fined $10,000 for kicking a ball into the stands,
> but Tim Floyd got away with a mere $5,000 for the same infraction.


2 kicks x $5,000 = $10,000. Pretty fair.


> Kevin Garnett of the Timberwolves and Ruben Patterson of the Trail
> Blazers, on the other hand, were fined $5,000 each for throwing a ball
> into the stands.


??? And that doesn't make sense... how?



> Of all the fines handed down lately, though, I have to admit to a
> personal favorite. It came when Suns assistant Tim Grgurich was
> relieved of $7,500 for verbally abusing a member of the media. I never
> thought I'd live to see the day.


If I'm not wrong, I thought he challenged the guy to a fight.


27 Feb 2004 00:23:13
Yep
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets


"Terraholm" <terraholm_SpamGoAway@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:103tbdf2tsou71f@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Isaac" <isaac@latveria.castledoom.org> wrote in message
> news:slrnc3t6fd.7m.isaac@latveria.castledoom.org...
>
> > > the officials. Shaquille O'Neal was the big loser in this department
> > > when he lost a day's pay, $275,000, for swearing while criticizing the
> > > refs.
> >
> > I don't think a suspension should be compared with a fine. Otherwise
> > we'd have to make suspensions proportional to salary. Shaq could only
> > be suspended for the first 5 minutes of games to match other players
> > getting a full game suspension.
>
>
> Actually a suspension is a better proportional punishment. 1/90 of their
> pay. Hits a minimum player just as hard as Shaq. It also effects more than
> their bank account so may better get their attention.

IMO, quite actually, proportional punishment for each act does sound fairer
than a flat fee.




27 Feb 2004 09:06:26
cLIeNUX user
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

humbubba@smart.net
>> Here are just some of the fines that have been handed down this
>> season. See if you can find a method to the NBA's madness.
>
>They have a tendency to fine a person more if they have more money. No one
>else would have gotten fined $500,000 for critizing officiating! Since it
>goes to charity, is it tax deductible? =)

Shaq was on national TV, and I presume Buss paid the fine as an investment
in better officiating, which bought them a win in Denver, but not over the
Kings at Staples. The Kings were able to shoot over the top of the
officials with Stojakovic and Bibby, even with Lakers smacking them all
game like hockey players.

Imagine basketball without the Lakers. No hop-step, no carry-dribble... I
can't imagine what sort of carnage Shaq's elbows have inspired on
playgrounds around America.

And the sad thing is, when talking about dirty players on the Lakers, I'm
pulling a lot of punches. You look up "dirty player" in the dictionary,
rest assured, the illustration is a Laker.

Rick Hohensee
Precision Mojo Engineer



27 Feb 2004 06:37:56
D. Gerasimatos
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

In article <9vOdnTvW34EsTqPdRVn_iw@comcast.com >, Yep <ELZ@TOOL.com> wrote:
>
>IMO, quite actually, proportional punishment for each act does sound fairer
>than a flat fee.


It is this thinking that has people paying $250K traffic fines in
Scandinavia.


Maybe they should base it on net worth or on their parents' income.
Sheesh.


Dimitri



27 Feb 2004 18:43:02
Yep
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets


"D. Gerasimatos" <dim@soda.csua.berkeley.edu > wrote in message
news:c1mok4$lho$1@agate.berkeley.edu...
> In article <9vOdnTvW34EsTqPdRVn_iw@comcast.com>, Yep <ELZ@TOOL.com> wrote:
> >
> >IMO, quite actually, proportional punishment for each act does sound
fairer
> >than a flat fee.
>
>
> It is this thinking that has people paying $250K traffic fines in
> Scandinavia.

We're not talking about traffic tickets...we're talking about relative cash
penalties as they relate to basketball players.

>
>
> Maybe they should base it on net worth or on their parents' income.

Let's not get silly.

> Sheesh.
>
>
> Dimitri
>




28 Feb 2004 00:14:14
D. Gerasimatos
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

In article <4vOdnZQgfrbrSKLdRVn-vg@comcast.com >, Yep <ELZ@TOOL.com> wrote:
>>
>> Maybe they should base it on net worth or on their parents' income.
>
>Let's not get silly.


It's not silly. Lots of NBA players have significant incomes outside of
their NBA salary. So making it proportional can *still* hurt the little guy
more than the highly paid player - and what about the NBA player with a small
salary, but lots of endorsements like Yao or Lebron?


Dimitri



28 Feb 2004 00:27:51
Yep
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets


"D. Gerasimatos" <dim@soda.csua.berkeley.edu > wrote in message
news:c1omgm$189d$1@agate.berkeley.edu...
> In article <4vOdnZQgfrbrSKLdRVn-vg@comcast.com>, Yep <ELZ@TOOL.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Maybe they should base it on net worth or on their parents' income.
> >
> >Let's not get silly.
>
>
> It's not silly.

That is silly...parents income...

>Lots of NBA players have significant incomes outside of
> their NBA salary. So making it proportional can *still* hurt the little
guy
> more than the highly paid player - and what about the NBA player with a
small
> salary, but lots of endorsements like Yao or Lebron?

Having a significant income outside the NBA is irrelevant, IMO. I'm talking
about having their NBA income proportionally taken.

Example: If Shaq is penalized, then his fine would be 1/82 of his annual
salary. The same would be for Allen Iverson, Rasheed Wallace, (Dennis
Rodman--I know he isn't playing...just a hypothetical on this one). Or
instead of giving up an entire games worth of salary, make'em give up 1/164
(half a game), or 1/328 (equivalent to one quarter of a game of their yearly
salary).




28 Feb 2004 07:17:01
D. Gerasimatos
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets

In article <7PKdnb4nRLXau93dRVn-uQ@comcast.com >, Yep <ELZ@TOOL.com> wrote:
>
>That is silly...parents income...


Nothing silly about it. What if the player earns the NBA minimum, but his
parents are fabulously wealthy? Can his daddy pay the fine? If his daddy
does pay the fine, is he really being punished?


>Having a significant income outside the NBA is irrelevant, IMO. I'm talking
>about having their NBA income proportionally taken.


Why? To what end?


Dimitri



28 Feb 2004 10:47:24
Yep
Re: Inconsistent NBA picks players' pockets


"D. Gerasimatos" <dim@soda.csua.berkeley.edu > wrote in message
news:c1pf9d$1fvi$1@agate.berkeley.edu...
> In article <7PKdnb4nRLXau93dRVn-uQ@comcast.com>, Yep <ELZ@TOOL.com> wrote:
> >
> >That is silly...parents income...
>
>
> Nothing silly about it.

OK, it's ridiculous then.

>What if the player earns the NBA minimum, but his
> parents are fabulously wealthy? Can his daddy pay the fine? If his daddy
> does pay the fine, is he really being punished?

Give me a break. You can't be serious.

>
>
> >Having a significant income outside the NBA is irrelevant, IMO. I'm
talking
> >about having their NBA income proportionally taken.
>
>
> Why? To what end?

My comment was referring to their NBA salary, not their extracurricular
income.

<un-snip >
Example: If Shaq is penalized, then his fine would be 1/82 of his annual
salary. The same would be for Allen Iverson, Rasheed Wallace, (Dennis
Rodman--I know he isn't playing...just a hypothetical on this one). Or
instead of giving up an entire games worth of salary, make'em give up 1/164
(half a game), or 1/328 (equivalent to one quarter of a game of their yearly
salary).